Hello Jim, hello Sam,
you search for coders to get wiki-search out. There are already a lot of coders in the list http://search.wikia.com/wiki/search:Developers
What do you think about a collaboration with limewire ?
http://www.limewire.org/forum/showthread.php?p=3090&posted=1#post3090
Integrate yacy in limewire and built up a colaboration with yacy, limewire and messenger cspace (ported to java) for wikia and wikimedia foundation.
Both are java. Kind regards tom.
On 30/12/06, [email protected] [email protected] wrote:
Hello Jim, hello Sam,
you search for coders to get wiki-search out. There are already a lot of coders in the list http://search.wikia.com/wiki/search:Developers
What do you think about a collaboration with limewire ?
http://www.limewire.org/forum/showthread.php?p=3090&posted=1#post3090
Integrate yacy in limewire and built up a colaboration with yacy, limewire and messenger cspace (ported to java) for wikia and wikimedia foundation.
Both are java. Kind regards tom.
Preliminary: All respects to Limewire and the hard work that's been put into the development of the software. Also, I'm not making judgement on what the technologies behind Limewire enable end-users to do (FWIW, I am certainly *not* siding with the RIAA!).
Someone on these mailing lists a couple of days ago wrote that Wikimedia was the only Web 2.0 venture that really took copyright seriously. Being the leading project in the free-content movement, taking copyright seriously is necessary to furthering our cause and our goals. I do not think it would help us to collaborate with projects which are seen by some (perhaps many) to be legally shady when it comes to copyright. Whether or not we agree with the notion that technology which enables copyright violation should be accountable for any copyright violation that occurs using the technology, we need to respect the law and need to appear above-the-board.
Hi Oldak,
well ok, you are right, then employee the limewire coders (in the background) for yacy in wiki sytle and cspace in java integrated, and we are done, then limewire is free, to implement yacy for themselves without any relationship to wikipedia. As Nobody knows, that limewire Sam coded the yacy wiki search p2p engine with cspace-java, as all is open source, limewire can use it as well without wiki branding.
tom
-------- Original-Nachricht -------- Datum: Sat, 30 Dec 2006 12:29:21 +0000 Von: "Oldak Quill" [email protected] An: "Wikimedia Foundation Mailing List" [email protected] Betreff: Re: [Foundation-l] wiki search & wikimedia foundation collaboration with Limewire and Yacy ?
On 30/12/06, > > Hello Jim, hello Sam,
you search for coders to get wiki-search out. There are already a lot of coders in the list http://search.wikia.com/wiki/search:Developers
What do you think about a collaboration with limewire ?
http://www.limewire.org/forum/showthread.php?p=3090&posted=1#post3090
Integrate yacy in limewire and built up a colaboration with yacy,
limewire and messenger cspace (ported to java) for wikia and wikimedia foundation.
Both are java. Kind regards tom.
Preliminary: All respects to Limewire and the hard work that's been put into the development of the software. Also, I'm not making judgement on what the technologies behind Limewire enable end-users to do (FWIW, I am certainly *not* siding with the RIAA!).
Someone on these mailing lists a couple of days ago wrote that Wikimedia was the only Web 2.0 venture that really took copyright seriously. Being the leading project in the free-content movement, taking copyright seriously is necessary to furthering our cause and our goals. I do not think it would help us to collaborate with projects which are seen by some (perhaps many) to be legally shady when it comes to copyright. Whether or not we agree with the notion that technology which enables copyright violation should be accountable for any copyright violation that occurs using the technology, we need to respect the law and need to appear above-the-board.
-- Oldak Quill ([email protected]) _______________________________________________ foundation-l mailing list [email protected] http://mail.wikipedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
Hoi, If there is one thing that is relevant, then it is that Peer to Peer technology can be used for more than just copying material from one computer to another. The faulty argument used by the proprietary content industry is that because of sharing in a peer to peer network you must be a criminal. This is utter rubbish. Consequently this is exactly one of the projects were Open Source and Open Content projects need to work together because it will show that a complete technology is unjustly stigmatised.
When this technology is used in a way that is in line with the way the WMF treats copyright, we will be able to create an infrastructure where both organisations and communities will work together. I do applaud it when it can be a true cooperation, a cooperation where everybody collaborates for their own reasons and create something that everybody will be happy with.
Thanks, GerardM
Oldak Quill schreef:
On 30/12/06, [email protected] [email protected] wrote:
Hello Jim, hello Sam,
you search for coders to get wiki-search out. There are already a lot of coders in the list http://search.wikia.com/wiki/search:Developers
What do you think about a collaboration with limewire ?
http://www.limewire.org/forum/showthread.php?p=3090&posted=1#post3090
Integrate yacy in limewire and built up a colaboration with yacy, limewire and messenger cspace (ported to java) for wikia and wikimedia foundation.
Both are java. Kind regards tom.
Preliminary: All respects to Limewire and the hard work that's been put into the development of the software. Also, I'm not making judgement on what the technologies behind Limewire enable end-users to do (FWIW, I am certainly *not* siding with the RIAA!).
Someone on these mailing lists a couple of days ago wrote that Wikimedia was the only Web 2.0 venture that really took copyright seriously. Being the leading project in the free-content movement, taking copyright seriously is necessary to furthering our cause and our goals. I do not think it would help us to collaborate with projects which are seen by some (perhaps many) to be legally shady when it comes to copyright. Whether or not we agree with the notion that technology which enables copyright violation should be accountable for any copyright violation that occurs using the technology, we need to respect the law and need to appear above-the-board.
Wikiasari will be a service of Wikia, not Wikimedia.
On 12/30/06, Gerard Meijssen [email protected] wrote:
Hoi, If there is one thing that is relevant, then it is that Peer to Peer technology can be used for more than just copying material from one computer to another. The faulty argument used by the proprietary content industry is that because of sharing in a peer to peer network you must be a criminal. This is utter rubbish. Consequently this is exactly one of the projects were Open Source and Open Content projects need to work together because it will show that a complete technology is unjustly stigmatised.
When this technology is used in a way that is in line with the way the WMF treats copyright, we will be able to create an infrastructure where both organisations and communities will work together. I do applaud it when it can be a true cooperation, a cooperation where everybody collaborates for their own reasons and create something that everybody will be happy with.
Thanks, GerardM
Oldak Quill schreef:
On 30/12/06, [email protected] [email protected] wrote:
Hello Jim, hello Sam,
you search for coders to get wiki-search out. There are already a lot of coders in the list http://search.wikia.com/wiki/search:Developers
What do you think about a collaboration with limewire ?
http://www.limewire.org/forum/showthread.php?p=3090&posted=1#post3090
Integrate yacy in limewire and built up a colaboration with yacy,
limewire and messenger cspace (ported to java) for wikia and wikimedia foundation.
Both are java. Kind regards tom.
Preliminary: All respects to Limewire and the hard work that's been put into the development of the software. Also, I'm not making judgement on what the technologies behind Limewire enable end-users to do (FWIW, I am certainly *not* siding with the RIAA!).
Someone on these mailing lists a couple of days ago wrote that Wikimedia was the only Web 2.0 venture that really took copyright seriously. Being the leading project in the free-content movement, taking copyright seriously is necessary to furthering our cause and our goals. I do not think it would help us to collaborate with projects which are seen by some (perhaps many) to be legally shady when it comes to copyright. Whether or not we agree with the notion that technology which enables copyright violation should be accountable for any copyright violation that occurs using the technology, we need to respect the law and need to appear above-the-board.
foundation-l mailing list [email protected] http://mail.wikipedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
Hoi, I also read Anthere's later posting to this effect. It does not detract anything from what I have said though. I would welcome collaboration between organisations including the WMF, Thanks, GerardM
James Hare schreef:
Wikiasari will be a service of Wikia, not Wikimedia.
On 12/30/06, Gerard Meijssen [email protected] wrote:
Hoi, If there is one thing that is relevant, then it is that Peer to Peer technology can be used for more than just copying material from one computer to another. The faulty argument used by the proprietary content industry is that because of sharing in a peer to peer network you must be a criminal. This is utter rubbish. Consequently this is exactly one of the projects were Open Source and Open Content projects need to work together because it will show that a complete technology is unjustly stigmatised.
When this technology is used in a way that is in line with the way the WMF treats copyright, we will be able to create an infrastructure where both organisations and communities will work together. I do applaud it when it can be a true cooperation, a cooperation where everybody collaborates for their own reasons and create something that everybody will be happy with.
Thanks, GerardM
Oldak Quill schreef:
On 30/12/06, [email protected] [email protected] wrote:
Hello Jim, hello Sam,
you search for coders to get wiki-search out. There are already a lot of coders in the list http://search.wikia.com/wiki/search:Developers
What do you think about a collaboration with limewire ?
http://www.limewire.org/forum/showthread.php?p=3090&posted=1#post3090
Integrate yacy in limewire and built up a colaboration with yacy,
limewire and messenger cspace (ported to java) for wikia and wikimedia foundation.
Both are java. Kind regards tom.
Preliminary: All respects to Limewire and the hard work that's been put into the development of the software. Also, I'm not making judgement on what the technologies behind Limewire enable end-users to do (FWIW, I am certainly *not* siding with the RIAA!).
Someone on these mailing lists a couple of days ago wrote that Wikimedia was the only Web 2.0 venture that really took copyright seriously. Being the leading project in the free-content movement, taking copyright seriously is necessary to furthering our cause and our goals. I do not think it would help us to collaborate with projects which are seen by some (perhaps many) to be legally shady when it comes to copyright. Whether or not we agree with the notion that technology which enables copyright violation should be accountable for any copyright violation that occurs using the technology, we need to respect the law and need to appear above-the-board.
-------- Original-Nachricht -------- Datum: Sat, 30 Dec 2006 11:10:08 -0500 Von: "James Hare" [email protected] An: "Wikimedia Foundation Mailing List" [email protected] Betreff: Re: [Foundation-l] wiki search & wikimedia foundation collaboration with Limewire and Yacy ?
Wikiasari will be a service of Wikia, not Wikimedia.
yes, you posted this already, and I got it now, though Angela refused this seperation of foundation and wikia, after your mail: http://mail.wikipedia.org/pipermail/foundation-l/2006-December/012721.html That´s why I used the foundation list again in CC.
Anyway, then let´s concentrate on the search-l of wikia, though I think it is wrong to have the foundation not in the boat. Then the new search engine has nothing to do with wikipedia and then the media hype is not understandable. Is Jimmy then a freerider of the wikipedia lable ?
Earning money with wikia (search) riding on wiki and wikipedia/ wikimedia-foundation is then like ... dunno how to compare.. but possible.
From the content view it is time to have an open source engine and I do not understand, why wikipedia community should be not participating in this, a common or a similar project.
I think it is not ok, that the wikipedia community think wikia-search is from wikipedia and they support the profit interest of wikia by free work, which resuls in a search engine, which is free, but not open source (maybe the search engine is open source coded, but the database has to be payed as a free, but not open source software). Jimmy speeks freely of a licensed engine...
Kind regards. tom
On 30/12/06, [email protected] [email protected] wrote:
Anyway, then let´s concentrate on the search-l of wikia, though I think it is wrong to have the foundation not in the boat. Then the new search engine has nothing to do with wikipedia and then the media hype is not understandable. Is Jimmy then a freerider of the wikipedia lable ?
The media hype is entirely a storm in a teacup, as I understand it.
Basically, wikia had a search project, a year or two ago. It fell into disuse, but the site hung around. Then Jimmy made some passing comment about how a wiki-based search engine would be a good thing to a journalist, who rooted around and found the old project site, put two and two together, and got seventeen. And then everyone else took their stories from him, so...
Wikia discovered that there were a plethora of news stories about it suddenly appearing, and took this opportunity to kickstart the old project. Nothing new was created; it just got a lot of interest because of the media hype.
Wikimedia/Wikipedia is not involved, and has never been involved; this is just the fault of people getting confused between Wikia and Wikimedia, and certainly isn't a deliberate attempt to get leverage off the name. Journalists tend to assume that anything Jimmy does is talking about Wikipedia, hence the linkage - if Wikia had announced this themselves, they'd have been able to make it clear from the outset that it was *them* not the Foundation doing it, but sadly the stories sort of ran ahead of them.
One day, we'll be able to get all these subtle differences explained to journalists. I hope that magic day comes soon... as it is, we have a hard enough time explaining to people that the Foundation a) does things which aren't the English Wikipedia, or b) doesn't operate every wiki on the planet.
[email protected] wrote:
-------- Original-Nachricht -------- Datum: Sat, 30 Dec 2006 11:10:08 -0500 Von: "James Hare" [email protected] An: "Wikimedia Foundation Mailing List" [email protected] Betreff: Re: [Foundation-l] wiki search & wikimedia foundation collaboration with Limewire and Yacy ?
Wikiasari will be a service of Wikia, not Wikimedia.
yes, you posted this already, and I got it now, though Angela refused this seperation of foundation and wikia, after your mail: http://mail.wikipedia.org/pipermail/foundation-l/2006-December/012721.html
You misunderstood. She did not refuse separation of Wikia and Wikimedia Foundation. She explained that Wikiasari was not a Wikia project either.
That´s why I used the foundation list again in CC.
Anyway, then let´s concentrate on the search-l of wikia, though I think it is wrong to have
the foundation not in the boat. Then the new search engine has nothing to do with wikipedia and then the media hype is not understandable.
Precisely correct. The search engine has nothing to do with Wikipedia. And the media hype is not understandable.
Is Jimmy then a freerider of the wikipedia lable ?
I can not comment, as I am not really sure of what "lable" mean here.
Earning money with wikia (search) riding on wiki and wikipedia/ wikimedia-foundation is then like
... dunno how to compare.. but possible.
From the content view it is time to have an open source engine and I do not understand,
why wikipedia community should be not participating in this, a common or a similar project.
If Wikipedians want to participate to such a project, they can absolutely do so.
I think it is not ok, that the wikipedia community think wikia-search is from wikipedia
and they support the profit interest of wikia by free work, which resuls in a search engine, which is free, but not open source (maybe the search engine is open source coded, but the database has to be payed as a free, but not open source software).
The Wikipedia community does not think wikia-search if from Wikipedia. The media think so.
The Wikipedia community does not support the profit interest of Wikia by free work. Any one can go and help. But there is no more relationship.
Jimmy speeks freely of a licensed engine...
Yes, just as Jimbo can also have political opinions, maybe a belief in a certain God, preference for sushis over german sausages, and more willingness to date women than men.
Kind regards. tom
It may be that so many wikipedians support the idea of a freely licenced, search engine, built in collaboration, in the future tom. And it may be that in the future the Foudnation supports such a project. But right now Tom, there is nothing. It is just the press making up things.
I have no problem with you discussing this here, but please do realise that until 48 hours ago, none of us had ever heard of this project. We just discovered it through the press and are unrelated to it.
Best regards
Ant
-------- Original-Nachricht -------- Datum: Sat, 30 Dec 2006 18:14:44 +0100 Von: Anthere [email protected]
it may be that in the future the Foudnation supports such a project.
I have no problem with you discussing this here, but please do realise that until 48 hours ago, none of us had ever heard of this project. We just discovered it through the press and are unrelated to it.
Best regards
Ant
Hi Ant, that´s it. We need an initial discussion that the wikipedia/wikimedia foundation needs an open source search engine.
We should take time to discuss the need and the options brought by your idea for such a project. Keep wikia what it want to be. Let´s foundraise an own new open source search engine.
and I suggest to base upon http://yacy.net - the p2p webindex-search.
If then wikia chooses as well this idea, we can later collaborate as well. If Jimmy chooses the central engine "nutch", then we have our own.
So this is about to bring out the idea to the foundations in each country here on the list, and to start a thread about it on this list.
48 hours or one hours you bring up the idea here, and before the decisions here really start, we should discuss the option, to have in each wikipedia country a search field box, to search as well in the web with yacy.
Users can install the firefox toolbar, see here how it works:
http://www.yacy-websuche.de/wiki/index.php/De:YaCyBar
It would be wrong that the foundation goes to the press and says, we have nothing to do with it, we could use the hype to work out an own concept. With options for a collaboration with wikia.com
We should use the chance, to use the reality, which was created by the press, as it seems to be needed.
Would it be possible to run yacy.net on each wikipedia server (or other) and get the search box into the wikipedia left manue (at the bottom) )
The wikiepdia yacy server then could index the wikiepdia server. So please someone can forward this mail to the tech-admin list of the wikiservers? Thanks
Kind regards Tom
On 12/30/06, "Thomas Müller" [email protected] wrote:
Hi Ant, that´s it. We need an initial discussion that the wikipedia/wikimedia foundation needs an open source search engine.
The Wikimedia Foundation is not presently capable of funding, managing, designing, overseeing or implementing such a project.
[email protected] wrote:
Hello Jim, hello Sam,
you search for coders to get wiki-search out. There are already a lot of coders in the list http://search.wikia.com/wiki/search:Developers
What do you think about a collaboration with limewire ?
http://www.limewire.org/forum/showthread.php?p=3090&posted=1#post3090
Integrate yacy in limewire and built up a colaboration with yacy, limewire and messenger cspace (ported to java) for wikia and wikimedia foundation.
Both are java. Kind regards tom.
Maybe this needs to be repeated again, but 1) this mailing list is the list dedicated to Wikimedia Foundation issues 2) The Wikimedia Foundation is not involved in *any way* in the wiki-search project (if this project actually exist)
Incidently, who is Sam ?
Anthere